Ghost notes...

  • This is an incredibly strange problem!


    I too have my TI2 keyboard mounted on the second tier of my stand, supported by two arms, above a -- yup -- Nord Stage 2! Very strange indeed, as I suffer from the very occasional ghost note. (just this past weekend it scared the **** out of me - had a very loud patch set up in my Elektron A4, controlled via MIDI from the TI2, and after an hour or so of idle, out of nowhere comes the patch being played). Now of course one may suspect that it's the A4 that has the issue, but it never happens if the TI2 is off, and I've had other notes where I didn't have a pure midi patch (local off) dialed in to the TI2 also get played via ghost note.


    Now, I am purely a studio hobbyist, not doing any of this in a gig environment or even for money, so I can live with the occasional glitch. But I find it very odd that merely tilting it level and putting the TI2 so that its rubber feet perfectly sit on top of the arms would fix the problem. FWIW, mine is not touching any metal, there are two very large rubber pads already mounted on the arms that it sits on, so I highly doubt there is any electrical short happening as a result.


    Also, I've owned this TI2 kbd for less than a year. Had a TI2 desktop before it, and it too would throw the occasional ghost note.

  • Yeah.


    That turned out not to be the solution. After a week or so, I got another ghost note. I still haven't had another stuck note, but that doesn't mean it won't happen again. I've tried to notice other consistencies when it happens, and so far (at least for the 4 ghost notes I've observed) they only happen on patches that have the Hold Pedal option Enabled. Of course, this, like everything else I've observed, may just be another coincidence.


    The first time this problem affects a live performance, depending on how badly it does, I'll probably be done with it. For good. I may get another Virus, I may not. It seems like an overly glitchy/buggy machine, and I don't have the time or the money to keep up a finicky BMW... Especially when my Volvo is in the million-mile club and running strong, bug-free for 8+ years.


    I also own three Moog synths (phatty, voyager, minitaur), and the entire line of moogerfoogers (+ a theremin), and you know how many problems I've had with Moog gear? ZERO. NONE. not a fucking one.


    However, I have owned two models of the Virus, the TI and TI2. I returned the TI after a week for MULTIPLE bugs and glitches. Now I've got this beautiful three thousand dollar machine that taunts me with uncertainty and unreliability.


    Access, you could learn a thing or two (or two thousand) from the good people at Moog Music.


    First and foremost , build a CONSISTENTLY RELIABLE product.


    Next, it wouldn't hurt to have a team dedicated to getting to the bottom of these bugs and fixing them, instead of saying, "well, if you can't recreate the problem, we can't fix it."


    That's fucked and you know it.

  • I must say last week I had my first ghost note at home. So that broke the mystery why they seem to appear only on stage when damage is maximal. Well they don't. Anyway I have chosen to tolerate this issue (and few others) for few reasons: virus sounds so great and unique that I simply cannot think anything to replace it. Also my Polar keyboard is great as a midi controller. And last, fortunately ghost notes happen so rarely.


    But reading this thread and seeing it alive, I cannot believe Access' response that it's just a minor malfunction of some individual units. I remember reading some similar issues as early as 2011 posts. If it's a hardware weakness or anything, it has been there quite a long time. Also, I am sure that there lot of users to whom this isn't very big thing. If I wasn't performing musician I probably wouldn't complain about this. For a studio producer things like TI problems are much more critical.


    It's very hard to believe that Access has no idea what is going on. If it's like that have they tried enough? For me it's just not possible to send my unit to germany for hoping those ghost notes to appear some day for Access analyse...

  • Just came home from a gig which was great and I did have great time with my Virus. Well until the last song: it was encore and band leader decided to give me a solo and band stopped playing. Guess what happened? Terrible hanging note(s) which disturbed the whole solo and once again I had to try cut them with panic button. Panic is a right word to describe my feelings. As said many many times these occational ghost notes aren't maybe that painful at home studio but in front of the audience they are horrible. Occational wrong notes are ok, they're your own fault but professional instrument should not be like this.


    Did I tell you that I made a special silent "break" presets to all my synths which I try to remember to choose every time I go to break between sets (to make sure that if there are ghosts, at least they are silent ones)...


    Marc or anybody from Access: still no idea what is wrong here? You probable have had few Viruses over the years, but none of them had ghosts?


    P

  • Guys, have you ever tried setting Local to off? This has been suggested before and its the best way to figure out if you're facing an issue with the keybed.


    Once you turn Local mode to off, you're basically turning the Polar into a Desktop and you'll have to play the Polar with an external MIDI Controller.


    You should try this a full week or two and if the Ghost notes disappear, then you have to send the Virus to Support Center to have the keybed fixed.

  • Next, it wouldn't hurt to have a team dedicated to getting to the bottom of these bugs and fixing them, instead of saying, "well, if you can't recreate the problem, we can't fix it."


    Yeah.


    Next, it wouldn't hurt to have a team dedicated to getting to the bottom of these bugs and fixing them, instead of saying, "well, if you can't recreate the problem, we can't fix it."


    I wouldn't count on it. It's time to admit that the USB implementation is a failure. Maybe they can do it again with thunderbolt, at that point there can be no more excuses about timing problems or bandwidth.

  • Resurrecting this old thread, I have finally tracked down the source of "ghost notes" in my setup to my Virus Ti 2 Keyboard.


    I recently added a Cirklon as the heart of my studio. It acts as the master MIDI router and clock, and all other devices sync to it, with all keyboards set to "Local off". This works great, as I can select a track on the Cirklon, and play the instrument that's assigned to that track from any connected keyboard or controller.


    When I leave my gear turned on but inactive - i.e. I'm away from the gear doing something else - I've come back several times to find sustained ghost notes playing on whatever instrument is currently selected. Through a process of elimination I've finally identified the Virus as the culprit. Pressing the panic buttons on the Virus clears the problem.


    For what it's worth, I upgraded to the latest OS on Saturday, so that hasn't fixed this bug.


    Cheers,


    Malcolm.

  • Resurrecting this old thread, I have finally tracked down the source of "ghost notes" in my setup to my Virus Ti 2 Keyboard.


    How bizzare! I was reading this thread this morning and I too had another ghost note about 3 hours later lol.. I left my virus on after a session, went down to the kitchen then BAM!! A patch from the Virus decides to shake the floor! Lol. Just one note!.. pressing panic stopped it but why does it happen? My virus had the usb connected and VC running in Reaper. This is the only time it has happened in about 3 months. I never unplug USB so it could be receiving a spurious note on message from somewhere on my PC via Reaper...I dunno..it never happens often enough to diagnose it. But seems like a full on 127 velocity message. Spooky! ?( Also running latest Virus OS. On win7 64bit.


    UPDATE!..


    I thought i would leave my virus on and also run MIDIOX (Midi monitor/sysex tool) in the background, i happened to get a ghost note, and it WAS definately the Virus TI2 keyboard sending a random E flat (2) single note all of its own will. Now, i beleive this was the last note i played before leaving it alone. playing the same note once, sent another on command then a note off command as it should, and switched the sound off.


    So, i think i agree that the virus is definately sending midi note on/off data randomly if left on all day, and left alone for around 1.5 hours (varies) MIDIOX proves the data is being sent from the Virus.


    Someone else please try this. see if you get the same results.


    My DAW (Reaper) is open, VC is running (nothing else, zero tracks loaded), A sound is selected in the Browser window, Live is selected in VC, virus connected via USB, Win 7 64bit, (own Belkin dedicated USB card)


    Run midiox too to prove the data is coming from the Virus midi ports....Sit back and wait for a ghost note... (you may need to wait an hour or two...) and dont play the virus.


    Hopefully we can crack this thing.


    Good luck. :thumbup:

  • Hi guys,


    As an original poster of this thread I am kind of happy to read that I am not alone with this. As a gigging professional musician I've had few horrible moments when I was having a break between sets and then someone from the audience comes to us and says that our PA makes a terrible loud sound. You can guess that it was Virus making ghost notes. After those insidents I made silent presets for making sure that it won't happen again. There're still ghosts for sure but now they are silent.


    I also contacted Access about this (and some other) issue but they said that nothing can be done to fix it. I had warranty left but they said it's useless to send it back. The whole thing remained quite unclear to me: they don't know what's wrong and to me it seemed that they don't care. It's "normal" Virus behaviour to have occational ghost notes...? Well, if it is to Access, to me it isn't: I've had synths and keyboards over 20 years and Virus is the first one making these.


    P.S. Ghost notes aren't the only things which Virus makes on it's own: I have seen bender and CC-messages too...

  • Ecaroh,


    Do you get these ghost notes when your Virus is stand alone, no midi leads or USB cable connected? because i certainly dont. It seems to be when a USB connection is made and VC is open.Its never really been a problem for me, but i can imagine it is a substantial problem for users like yourself who use the Virus live, and need that security it is going to remain silent when unused, I agree, it should be sorted out. If we can replicate the fault and prove to access there is a problem, im sure they could fix it. No one seems that bothered though... :S

  • Got a chance to test the Virus connected to MIDIOX. The last note I played from the Virus was a C4. In the space of an hour, Virus generated the following MIDI messages all by itself:



    000D04A9 1 -- 90 24 22 1 C 2 Note On
    000D04AA 1 -- 90 24 18 1 C 2 Note On
    000D04AE 1 -- 90 24 00 1 C 2 Note Off


    and



    0006E0AE 1 2 E0 00 66 1 --- Pitch Bend
    0006E0B6 1 2 E0 60 40 1 --- Pitch Bend
    0006E0C2 1 2 E0 00 40 1 --- Pitch Bend



    Ghosts in the machine. :evil:

  • Odd... iv'e never had pitch bend messages, though that is easily done by knocking the sensitive mod wheel, but the last note you played was in fact the ghost note too, theres a common factor for strarters. Did you have any USB or Midi cables connected? or was the Virus standalone nothing connected?

  • Hi guys,


    I am using my Polar with MIDI in/out cables to iConnect MIDI and I've seen many ghost notes, bender and CC messages. I've captured them to Logic and seen them in Midi monitor app. Last time when I tested this I left my Polar alone over a night and recorded everything with Midi Monitor. I remember capturing some CCs and bender ghosts (though not ghost notes that time...).


    So I am sure that (at least my) Polar can generate them this way. This is not USB or TI-problematic.


    Access keeps the silence about these problematics. Maybe it's some radio interference or something who knows....

  • I know this is an old thread but I just found it and I am glad I am not alone.


    I am alone on a few things however...


    1. I only use my machine in stand alone live applications.
    2. My ghost note sounds like an INIT patch sound at a 32nd note... real quick, barely noticeable in live format.
    3. After the ghost note occurs my octave drops -12 and if the ghost note happens to do it again it will correct itself +12


    I have mastered the quick octave change during a song... but Access couldn't really help. Perhaps the ghost in the machine is real after all... or maybe there is a real issue here that needs some R and D!


    I don't know if anyone is still having these problems after 5.0.8 but I have a comp on order to meet the specs of Windows 64 bit and maybe the new OS and firmware will help.


    Thanks for the thread to know that it is not just something I did to my machine.

  • Hi there,



    I have the same annoying problem with ghost notes, mostly when the room temperature rises above 23 C .. I want to use the TI2 Polar in my live setup (also as audio interface) but it is almost useless when it alsways triggers some notes and one has to push the panic buttons to stop that. Had that problem during my last gig for several times and it almost ruined that track..


    An other problem is that the TI2 sometimes seems to loose the internal Clock-Lock, the Delay Effect then gets some weird up-pitching-effect for 1 or 2 seconds before it locks back to the tempo :-/



    Maybe it is a way better idea to sell that crappy TI and buy another rock solid Nord Lead.. Never had any problems with any of my Nords.

  • I have also been hit by the dreaded "ghost notes"


    My Virus has never been gigged... I use it strictly in my studio and it has worked fine since I bought it. I had to move my studio around and it sat disconnected for about a year while the new studio got built and I connected everything back up and everything works.....except the Virus.


    It plays a long sustained note randomly as well as volume going down and bizarre results when using the ring modulator, pole filters, resonance, random bouts of latency etc...


    It is heartbreaking because I saved up a lot of money to buy this thing and for seemingly no reason it is acting so unpredictably it is unusable... It happens a few minutes into using it every time. I have come across quite a few posts across the internet by people that have this problem but I am yet to see any solutions....... this was a working system and there have been no changes to any hard or software... I am running firmware 5.1.1.0. The only thing that may have changed are the USB ports I plugged it back in to but I really don't see why that would cause such a massive problem??


    Can anyone help? Please? I am desperate to get this working again...

  • Hi everyone.... little update here -


    I followed the helpful guide here - http://virus.info/api/download/dlid/389/n/Virus TI Setup Guide.pdf which may help some people... but I tried everything and the problem still persists..


    I have noticed a trend though..... if I use my midi controller keyboard to control the Virus, it seems that the problem does not occur but if I use the keys on the virus... that is when the problem happens. So for now, I have a workaround which might help some people out there!