Could someone explain the AUX buses in the Virus A, B and C?

    I've read the manuals but can't really get my head around how this actually works. I only have a TI so I can't try it out.


    Is it possible, with internal routing, for sound shapers to interact between patches, so that you could use an envelope or LFO from one patch to modulate pulse with or oscillator pitch of another patch? I read something somewhere that indicated that this was possible, but I assumed it would have to be a source doorway in the mod matrix for this to be possible(?) ?(


    Is it possible, in virus A, B and C multi mode, to chain several patches in series so that one could say place filters AFTER an effect, and then add another effect and then yet another filter after that and so on, everything affecting the same, one and only, single patch?

    I've been reading and re-reading your post, and I find it hard to think of where to start, because your question is not phrased in "standard" Virus terms (besides the fact that you posted it on the wrong forum section). In any case I'll try my best:
    The Virus line is backword compatible, and features are only added. Therefore, it is not possible that an older model had some routing scheme that is not supported by the newest TI.
    By AUX bus maybe you meant the effects bus? The A thru C models had a central effect unit for delay and reverb, and each patch could only choose how much to send to that unit. The TI models implement delay and reverb separately for each part, but due to the linear nature of those effects, if you set the same type for all of the parts, it will sound the same as a central unit [or mathematically: Fx(a(t))+Fx(b(t)) = Fx(a(t)+b(t)) where t is time and a and b are audio waveforms].
    Regarding re-processing one part by another, that is possible to some extent in multi mode if you set some part a, e.g. to out3 L+R, then connect out3 L+R to the inputs using TRS leads, load/create an input based patch on part b and set it to out1 L+R (make it twin unison if you want stereo, and note the various input modes). Play part a, and part b will affect it, part b might behave differently depending on whether it gets keyboard input or not. This is limited to only one send between only two parts at any given time.
    Here is an example of the result of such a setup, plus part b was also fed back to itself (custom cabling ;) ).
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    Hope I covered everything.

    Zitat von flabberbob

    I've been reading and re-reading your post, and I find it hard to think of where to start, because your question is not phrased in "standard" Virus terms

    Hm.. Ok.

    Zitat von flabberbob

    (besides the fact that you posted it on the wrong forum section).

    I see now that I should have posted this in "Questions and answers about Virus synthesizers" in the public section. Sorry about that.

    Zitat von flabberbob

    The Virus line is backword compatible, and features are only added. Therefore, it is not possible that an older model had some routing scheme that is not supported by the newest TI.

    I think you're wrong here, as it certainly seems to be things you can do with the older viruses that the TI line doesn't support. Internal routing as mentioned, and external LFO triggering (Virus B manual page 241) are two examples.

    Zitat von flabberbob

    By AUX bus maybe you meant the effects bus? The A thru C models had a central effect unit for delay and reverb, and each patch could only choose how much to send to that unit. The TI models implement delay and reverb separately for each part, but due to the linear nature of those effects, if you set the same type for all of the parts, it will sound the same as a central unit [or mathematically: Fx(a(t))+Fx(b(t)) = Fx(a(t)+b(t)) where t is time and a and b are audio waveforms].

    I get that. I like the true multimbrality of the TI's effects section and I off course don't want that replaced with global effects.

    Zitat von flabberbob

    Regarding re-processing one part by another, that is possible to some extent in multi mode if you set some part a, e.g. to out3 L+R, then connect out3 L+R to the inputs using TRS leads, load/create an input based patch on part b and set it to out1 L+R (make it twin unison if you want stereo, and note the various input modes). Play part a, and part b will affect it, part b might behave differently depending on whether it gets keyboard input or not. This is limited to only one send between only two parts at any given time.

    Yeah. With the B I assumed it only was possible to add extra filtering and effects by routing one patch to another in multi mode, like with the TI, only without using physical cables, but as I mentioned before, I read something in some thread about it indeed being possible to affect the oscillator section of another patch as well, but it was an answer to someone having a problem with something, and there's always a chance that the one answering in that thread never actually tried this himself and just assumed this was possible.. This is what made me curious, as it would allow for a lot of complexity if possible.


    About the chaining of effects and filtering to the same patch, I'd expect this to be limited by the number of AUX buses, but I don't know. I don't have a Virus B here to test this.


    Zitat von flabberbob

    Here is an example of the result of such a setup, plus part b was also fed back to itself (custom cabling ;) ).
    [soundcloud]

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    [/soundcloud]
    Hope I covered everything.


    Sounds cool. Anyway, thanks for trying to help.

    Here's a diagram of the old Virus signal flow, available on the download section of this site. I hope it helps to clarify.

    Zitat von HUBA

    I think you're wrong here, as it certainly seems to be things you can do with the older viruses that the TI line doesn't support. Internal routing as mentioned, and external LFO triggering (Virus B manual page 241) are two examples.

    Are you referring to the retriggering of the LFO-s via CC#70 and CC#82 (LFO mode select)? You can try that yourself - just draw/copy/paste those CC messages (with value 0 for poly LFO and 1 for mono LFO) in your DAW and send them to a Virus part that is loaded with a patch that has some prominent LFO modulation, and see what happens.

    Zitat von flabberbob

    Here's a diagram of the old Virus signal flow, available on the download section of this site. I hope it helps to clarify.


    Thanks!


    Zitat von flabberbob

    Are you referring to the retriggering of the LFO-s via CC#70 and CC#82 (LFO mode select)?


    Yes.


    Zitat von flabberbob

    You can try that yourself - just draw/copy/paste those CC messages (with value 0 for poly LFO and 1 for mono LFO) in your DAW and send them to a Virus part that is loaded with a patch that has some prominent LFO modulation, and see what happens.


    I'm having problems making my Polar respond to CC messages other than volume, pan and a few others, so can't try this before I find out what's wrong. (I've probably just overlooked something overly obvious as usual.) Anyway, if all this does with the TI is switching between poly and mono mode it's not too interesting, and if the same goes for the Virus B, then I'd say the Virus B manual is somewhat misleading:


    " External LFO Trigger
    You can also trigger an LFO at any time by means of a controller, in other words, restart its waveform cycle via remote control. LFO1 mode (Ctr #70), LFO2 mode (Ctr #82) and LFO3 mode provision controllers that you can use for this purpose (Parameter B 9, see the parameter documentation in the \"Appendix\" on page 251). \"

    I had a chance to test it myself but it didn't seem to work. I was able to make the MONO indicator blink in VC, but I couldn't make the LFO retrigger - not by sending the same value repeatedly neither alternating 0 and 1.
    I would really love to hear the official word from Access on this - was the above feature dropped, or was it simply overlooked?

    Zitat von flabberbob

    I had a chance to test it myself but it didn't seem to work. I was able to make the MONO indicator blink in VC, but I couldn't make the LFO retrigger - not by sending the same value repeatedly neither alternating 0 and 1.


    Sure it's not changing anyway? The mono/poly mode I mean? (At least with the TI I'm pretty sure it's not possible to retrigger the LFO waveforms without pressing a key.) When I tried controling it with my remote, and viewing the corespnding parameter in the TI display, it wouldn't show the changes I sent even though I could hear them(volume, pan, release). Have you checked that you can hear a difference when switching LFO mode from the TI itself?


    Zitat von flabberbob

    I would really love to hear the official word from Access on this - was the above feature dropped, or was it simply overlooked?


    So is your impression, when reading that bit I quoted from the Virus B manual, that this function is meant to retrigger the LFO waveform when sending CC#70 to LFO 1? It's strange that the same midi CC message should switch between LFO modes, which, at least with the TI, means poly or mono mode. Maybe I misunderstand something. The way it's written it's certainly open for interpretation.

    I recently went from a Virus C to a TI. Auxes were something I used frequently - they let you do some very powerful things with feedback that wouldn't be otherwise possible. I couldn't find the auxes on the TI, so I emailed support:



    So no, virus models are definitely not backwards compatible. Single patches might be. Multi setups are definitely not.