Mavericks Users?

Unfortunately I came across a rather crucial bug that I wanted to share here first and will proceed to submit the report through tech support. Let me preface this by saying I love my Virus TI and I have had nothing but great experiences dealing with customer support, so please don't interpret this post as a negative or as a means to "pile on" Access.

My audio interface is the Apogee Duet 2 (first gen, not the iOS). After downloading the latest release for my Virus, I noticed that Maestro 2, the GUI that controls the input options of the Duet 2, was crashing when trying to open it. After exhausting through the typical troubleshooting methods with no success, I reviewed the crash report and noticed in the Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/HAL directory there were .plugin files for both de.access.music and apogee. On a whim, I uninstalled the Virus software and everything returned to normal.

Cheers.

I am wondering if anyone else is seeing an issue with VSTi in Cubase 7.5 when automating VSTi parameters using the plug-in UI in Mavericks? Here are the repro steps for me as it is something I can do pretty reliably on my current machine:

Current machine is Mid 2011 iMac 3.1 GHz i5 version with 16 gigs of RAM. Using Virus as sound card. Virus TI V1. Latest Cubase and latest beta Virus updates.

1) Import drum loop and copy paste it until you have 16 measures and set Cubase to cycle playback (16 measures) <----Most likely an unnecessary step but I do it every time so I thought I should include it
2) Add rack instrument TI (Vst 2 or 3 version doesn't matter. I have crashed using both with these same steps)
3) Add MIDI track
4) If VC is not showing open it
5) Click the "w" button on the VC window (enabling writing of plug-in automation) and record 2-3 parameters in the UI
6) Crashes VSTi and takes Cubase with it

I have been automating filter 1 cutoff and resonance on the easy page mostly when I see this happen however I have made it happen with lfo 2 rate. It seems fine until there is automation happening in the plug-in UI. Really I am wondering if anyone else is seeing this problem. I will be sending an email to support as well.

hello I am forced to plug and unplug several times the virus ti often because there is no midi note passing or baucoup latency or its virus is very low with asio driver or bit accurate

bonjour je suis obliger de brancher et débrancher plusieur fois le virus ti souvent car il n'y a pas de notes midi qui passe ou avec baucoup de latences ou le son du virus est tres faible avec asio driver ou bitaccurate

Zitat von lostnthesound

Unfortunately I came across a rather crucial bug that I wanted to share here first and will proceed to submit the report through tech support. Let me preface this by saying I love my Virus TI and I have had nothing but great experiences dealing with customer support, so please don't interpret this post as a negative or as a means to "pile on" Access.

My audio interface is the Apogee Duet 2 (first gen, not the iOS). After downloading the latest release for my Virus, I noticed that Maestro 2, the GUI that controls the input options of the Duet 2, was crashing when trying to open it. After exhausting through the typical troubleshooting methods with no success, I reviewed the crash report and noticed in the Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/HAL directory there were .plugin files for both de.access.music and apogee. On a whim, I uninstalled the Virus software and everything returned to normal.

Cheers.

we are aware of this. the next version will contain a fix.
best, marc

Marc,
can you also confirm you are aware of the issue with 48khz sample rate not working... I included details on this thread, including a video showing the issue - but got no feedback from Access as to if you were able to reproduce etc.

to summarise:
if you use 48khz sample rate, this will cause issues with the USB midi, in particular causing extreme (i.e. unworkable) latency in notes and CC.
This is reproducible every time, and also is cured by moving to 44.1khz sample rate.

it would be very useful to know they ploytec are aware of this and also are working on fixing this... as it obviously makes 48khz unusable.

Thanks for your help
Mark

btw, I've now pointed this out to quite a few here (and elsewhere) e.g. Virus TI USB speed
it would be nice if Access, could at least acknowledge, so that not every user has to get caught out by it when they upgrade to 5.0.7

I think I'm going to sell mine. It's a great synth and everything but everything which has got something to do with connecting the synth with the computer is a horrible experience.

Zitat von Taavi

I think I'm going to sell mine. It's a great synth and everything but everything which has got something to do with connecting the synth with the computer is a horrible experience.

I've had a MK1 since 2006 and this is still a problem getting a reliable experience with the VC. I've been through several Macs and the same troubles plague this synth via USB, I think a recall is in order

Seriously though, I've been sat here for half an hour trying to get Mavericks to see the TI with 5.0.8. It's like a few people I know, they work when they fancy. Rubbish.

I gave up years ago trying to be helpful as I just got frustrated and probably annoyed a few people due to these obvious technical difficulties beyond our control.

I will say this though - If Access would decline and follow the route of the editor like that of the Moog Sub Phatty, which I also own, I think we may all be a lot happier. Bare in mind I don't use the TI as an audio interface here so I don't need to rely on that side of things as others may, but that's where I'm coming from. Built in librarian too, cant be that hard can it? USB for MIDI only, hardware audio outputs routed to my DAW via my interface (apollo in this case although that makes no difference!).

At this point I give up and download betas / updates and hope for the best.

Zitat von Sarrova-Q

Same problems as others here:
• 48 khz doesn't work at all
• Virus TI constantly looses USB connection
• latency (and the LIVE button sometimes disappears)
• ...

Any updates / plans to what access is doing?

48k: we are aware of that, once i have news, i'll relay them
lost connection: we are not aware of that, please contact support
live button: the button does not disappear, it cannot be switched when the sequencer is running. is that what you mean?

thanks, marc

Zitat von Sarrova-Q

Yes please, I want the same thing. If the whole total integration thing doesn't get better I would really like to have the choice to only use the USB for patch editing / storing.
Loose the audio over usb and make a stable editor please. That way, we still have patch recall when opening a DAW track but the TI would actually work.

Same problems as others here:
• 48 khz doesn't work at all
• Virus TI constantly looses USB connection
• latency (and the LIVE button sometimes disappears)
• ...

Any updates / plans to what access is doing?

Alles anzeigen

I also have all of the above problems.

To make it a bit clearer...

We all know 48Khz has been acknowledged, cool. The TI does lose connection as of this OS update. The only way I have been able to rectify it is by physically moving the USB cable to another port, do the TI reset method then go to Audio/MIDI utility and rescan the MIDI and it does tend to show up after that. Please note that is MIDI only as the TI does appear to be available as an audio interface, it's the MIDI that drops out for me.

With regards to latency, it does tend to have a mind of its own. I'm quite experienced with that one which is why I find / edit a patch and use it standalone. Still, does not work as advertised.

Zitat von Sarrova-Q

Yes please, I want the same thing. If the whole total integration thing doesn't get better I would really like to have the choice to only use the USB for patch editing / storing.
Loose the audio over usb and make a stable editor please. That way, we still have patch recall when opening a DAW track but the TI would actually work.

Same problems as others here:
• 48 khz doesn't work at all
• Virus TI constantly looses USB connection
• latency (and the LIVE button sometimes disappears)
• ...

Any updates / plans to what access is doing?

Alles anzeigen

I agree. small knob that switch to control and midi mode only. So we can control VST parameter for automaton and MIDI.
For sound analog out only.

I've noticed a few issues with my TI 1 Polar, some different under Mavericks.

I do get the TI sporadically loosing connection, often when things are first started up, or later if the daw settings are changed - in my case Logic X. When using 48k this morning I did here some crunchy hiss in the signal path, so I can confirm this one.

I don't tend to run at 48k so I haven't had too much of an issue there. In my experience the TI experience appears more stable under Live 9. The stability I describe is a reduction of clicks whilst playing back or just programming in VC. I say reduction as I've still experienced a few.

In Logic X I get regular but intermittent clicks upon playback and programming. This type of click I am 80-90% sure is an interruption TI/VC communication over USB. The core result of this audible click is a "wobble" of pitch (as if the tempo/timing info is being resynchronised) along with any delay line present exacerbating the problem.

I have wasted many countless hours conducting many experiments to find the root cause of this, a job which should be left to Access to do I might add. The cause I found to be most likely in my situation, was saving a project in Logic X. Before I go further can I be clear on one thing, as this took me a while to communicate to support - I never would expect any DAW to reliably carry on playing whilst saving, however Logic X "autosaves" in the application background whilst running. After going backwards and forwards with support it became clear Access were aware of this and have no solution to the issue, save for asking Apple to allow this autosave functionality to be an optional setting - I won't hold my breath on that one!

Now I haven't heard of anyone else noticing this behaviour, so it leaves me to the following conclusion:

This "issue" may only affect certain Macs - mine is a 2008 vintage Mac Pro. Perhaps newer systems running on SSDs don't block the computer I/O bus whilst conducting an autosave as much as on older hardware. Unless someone else confirms this, I will find out in a few months when I upgrade to a MBP. I have tried all the usual BS with checking my USB setup and it's on it's own bus. I'm tempted to see if a PCIe card would help but as I'm close to relegating my tower to server duties I probably won't.

Anyways, thought I'd add this here in case some other poor guinea pig has the misfortune of trying to work this one out.

Zitat von Totty

This "issue" may only affect certain Macs - mine is a 2008 vintage Mac Pro. Perhaps newer systems running on SSDs don't block the computer I/O bus whilst conducting an autosave as much as on older hardware. Unless someone else confirms this, I will find out in a few months when I upgrade to a MBP. I have tried all the usual BS with checking my USB setup and it's on it's own bus. I'm tempted to see if a PCIe card would help but as I'm close to relegating my tower to server duties I probably won't.

Anyways, thought I'd add this here in case some other poor guinea pig has the misfortune of trying to work this one out.

you know, i have a Mac Pro from 2008 myself. it is on mavericks and the virus software for a polar 2 is on 5.0.8. - i was working on a demo song for a future virus soundset yesterday for most of the day. i used logic x, so i guess we can say that we share a very similar setup. the demo song consists of a virus running on 16 parts and loads of instances running kontakt for the orchestra percussion. 44.1k, not 48k.
but i didn't discover what you discover. maybe because i spend some to find out what USB port works best for me. i didn't have a single connection loss and i didn't have a single instance where the keyboard wasn't sending notes anymore. don't get me wrong, i don't want to rub it in or show off what a great working setup i have but you might want to acknowledge as well that things are not as easy and reproducible as they might sound.
marc

I don't think its showing off Marc, I think its great to hear about working setups...

I eventually found a configuration that works really well for me with Ableton Live 9... but the exact setup that works differs on two different macs, and also changed when upgrading mac osx.

I think herein lies the issue, the TI driver is very sensitive to hardware and software setup.
Its unsurprising users get frustrated when trying to find the perfect set-up (or in some cases have to live with an 'imperfect setup' e.g. 44k rather than 48k),
and some may not have the (computer/midi/music hardware) experience to really be able to get to the bottom of the issues.

however, viewed positively, it can be done (experimentation was key for me too) ... and when you do get it working well, the TI combination is great.

perhaps it would be good for you to post about your setup... ( we have a similar one for ableton, where we discussed what worked, what didn't),
Id be interested as Ive just started using Logic X alongside ableton, so would love to hear about working setups...

some obvious questions:
- do you use an audio interface (or the virus), if so which... and do you use the analogue outs or USB?
- have you attempted to use 48khz?

Id love to hear more success stories, with different hardware , different DAWs, not because its showing off, but because it helps to balance the issues being raised, and also help us see which combinations seem to work.

Not at all Marc, If you can get it working, it's great that it can be done and gives me hope, especially on a practically identical machine to mine.

To be clear I have the apple installed Bluetooth and Wifi with my machine and an upgraded ATI Radeon HD 5770 as my old graphics card died. This may be totally be irrelevant but who knows.

For me though I've struggled over the years, sometimes thinking things were better only to find I was back to square one. I am going to attempt a complete reinstall of my entire machine to be absolutely sure that it's no erroneous driver or process causing a problem.

Not withstanding, support said to me that there was nothing that can be done to change the autosave in Logic x pretty much alluding to the fact it may be an issue. I'll report back once I've gone through a reinstall.

Cheers

Zitat von Marc

you know, i have a Mac Pro from 2008 myself. it is on mavericks and the virus software for a polar 2 is on 5.0.8. - i was working on a demo song for a future virus soundset yesterday for most of the day. i used logic x, so i guess we can say that we share a very similar setup. the demo song consists of a virus running on 16 parts and loads of instances running kontakt for the orchestra percussion. 44.1k, not 48k.
but i didn't discover what you discover. maybe because i spend some to find out what USB port works best for me. i didn't have a single connection loss and i didn't have a single instance where the keyboard wasn't sending notes anymore. don't get me wrong, i don't want to rub it in or show off what a great working setup i have but you might want to acknowledge as well that things are not as easy and reproducible as they might sound.
marc

Hi Marc. ok I’ve done a brand new install, absolutely nothing on my machine apart from:

OSX Mavericks 10.9.2
Logic Pro X 10.0.5
VC 5.0.8.00

No audio interface - in my case RME UFX (which was using Firewire) so I've directly connected my TI to my monitors.
Virus TI Polar 1 connected to middle USB port at back, no other USB at rear connected so Virus has own port and is not sharing with the Bluetooth controller built in.
Apple Keyboard & Apple Wired Mouse on USB via top front USB port.
WIFI disabled, Bluetooth disabled

In Logic X
Usual process buffer range to small
Latency comp to all (the default)
No other plugins loaded
Bit Accurate driver used - the core audio version has horrendous latency
Resulting latency @ 128 samples is 14.5 roundtrip / 8.2ms output

I’m totally out of ideas. At one stage I played some notes - no output was perceived for about 250ms (that’s my human estimate!) then the notes came, with the usual (in my case at least) pitch wobble resynchronisation. I cannot believe that no one else wouldn’t notice this - even if there is no delay in the patch the click is regularly audible, so on that point I have to say I guess I have a dud Problem is this has taken an inordinate amount of my time and I feel pretty peeved about that. A lot of people I speak to say to just use it with old skool midi and be done with it, but I totally want the total integration I don’t want to give up but man, how much time and effort is reasonable to get this working for me.

I have one more roll of the dice before I get a new MacBookPro in a few months, My really old MBP… That one will take a little more time as it’s not solely mine! Will come back when I get a chance.

Cheers