I think that this is something that everyone wants from their Virus
Access should be take this seriously and add this feature at the next update.
Unfortunately, it's Serum's prerogative. Nowadays, a lot of users sell Virus and change it to Spire & Serum. I wish Access think faster with new OS (6th edition).
I support this feature too, although I'm not entirely sure if the virus (whatever version) is technically able to do so. It could also go as far as the nord wave did. We might have to wait for the next generation of virus...
Seeing as the Architecture Waveforms have now been released as wavetables I'd really love to see this feature implemented in the Virus.
Ahahahahah, there is people asking for this since the Virus C ages...
...I would love too this feature!
i have a few synths with memory for user waves (Evolver, XV-5080, SY99). In all this time i uploaded waves to the SY99 once, it was just too tedious and 2 years later it didn't matter with new projects.
I guess most people are as lazy as i am. Ask any Blofeld user how often they change their waveforms.
While we all want the freedom to do whatever we like, ironically we never really use it later on.
Exceptions to the rule may exist.
However, would i love modern and fresh sounding wavetables in the Virus ? Hell yes.
So here is an idea for you guys who ask for user wavetable import:
why not ask Access if they are down to host a wavetable competition here on the website.
We agree on a root key, length, format and normalization level and post them.
Let's have people vote for their favourite top 3 or so and Access can implement them with the next OS update.
I would contribute a few of my own if somebody gets the ball rolling, but it won't be me.
So the ones of you who feel they need the latest wavetables please get to work and talk to Marc.
What resolution would you suggest for wave tables? The sample frequency? The point is that digital synthesis operates either with DDS or partitioned (indirekt) frequency Synthesis. I wonder if this is realized in a DSP based synth and I wonder secondly if it makes sense. But only of Version two you might be able to produce an artifact free wave when looping.
I am using this in my FPGA Workstation by applying a common DDS for the frequency generation and a subsequent PLL design offering 96.000 times the frequency of the tune.
With common techniques in DSPs this is not possible because it required extraordinary sample rates or you have to live with the artifacts caused by the unintended Phase shifts. For Details of this issue see here:
So the vendors started to use generic functions to shun this issue when defining waves with harmonics of high bandwidths. So I am not sure if that was an increase of quality.
Do you have any Information, how Spire / Serum do that?
Well, i clearly lack your depth of theory in this. For listening and comparing purposes 44.1kHz (slightly below F-1) makes most sense. A 96kHz version should be supplied for the top favored wavetables later on.
But first of all, somebody should talk to Access if they are cool with this idea.
Here is a youtube How-To-Do-It for generating the correct pitch and length:
44.1khz - F-1, -23.43 cents, 32 beats, 161.499bpm
96khz - F#0 +23.26 cents, 16 beats, 175.781bpm
I think the Virus wave tables are coded differently, some form of resynthesis, so there are no phase problems, but that is pure speculation.
That is the Point: As Long as you have a generic function, you can calculate any Point for any Phase in your Destination Domain, without any error (taking a good reconstruction filter into account when becoming analog later) so a simple Resolution with one value per sample frequency is enough.
But any wave stored in a ram requires a at least a multiple of it to be replayed perfectly and a nearly perfect pre filtered Trigger wave (in fact the frequency of the note). For straight Forward frequencies, like a 12 tone System, one might prepare the tables appropriately for this but with synths and things like vibrato, it is not possible.
The only way in a pure digital system is DDS and ignoring Nyquist by accepting several issues.
For a 1024 dot wave for example, and a 1% granularity of the vibrato, already 100 Mio clock cycles are required for a 1kH tune. This is possible in Hardware, but with PC-Synthesizer and it's limited number of samples / sec this might get pretty dirty.
One could think of a hybrid synth with an analog section for the wave table voice, acting on e.g. 1024 times the required frequency of the tone and driving the DDS-wave table. That would be smooth. I am using such things in my old PLD organ, which creates analog sine like sounds from a digital Domain, but resolution of the System was too low at that Point of time. I am only using a 64 dot "wave table" with fixed waves.
thanks for the explanation. See the whole idea in 2 steps:
1. a showcase of wavetables, which everybody can compare by listening to them instantly. All wavetables would need the same pitch, the same resolution, the same length. Then people vote for their favorite top 3 or top 5.
2. Let's say 10 wavetables get selected. The originators of these 10 wavetables will supply those wavetables once again, now this time in a format, that Access would specify, so that they have the flexibility to convert it, multisample it, resynthesize it, cut, wash, dry it as much as they deem necessary.
I think if it gets too complicated in step 1, you might lose half of the participants. I am a lazy dude, i would contribute and send in 3 or 5 wavetables as aif 44.1kHz mono 16 bit with the pitch and length i am told.
All other format questions i would only care about should my wavetables get selected and Access contacting me in which format i need to resend it
I think this makes it much easier
Should be no problem, but with fixed WT - where is the aspect of individual sounds?
Another, and possibly better choice, was a multichannel IFFT with coefficient control. One could Analyse any waveform and use it's LaPlace-Representation. Reconstruction in real time is easy with DSPs when using trigonometric synthesis like cordic or exponential functions (you get an octave shift of a sine wave my multiplication with itself).
I already did that with an old 56301 DSP.
With current DSPs, a pretty large number of channels = frequencies is possible without creating too much load for the ALU.
You know, the Microwave I (the one with analog filters) came out in '89 or '91 and while it had limited technology (of course state of the art at the time with their ASIC chip) the wavetables are even today a great source for coming up with all sorts of sounds, harsh, soft, abstract, aggressive, smooth transition, stepped transition. I am pretty sure each wavetable (derived from the PPG) is only available as a single wavetable without multisamples etc. And that's totally fine.
That would be the approach i would go for.
Right, but as said, I know the limits of wavetables since we use them in SDR, RADAR and LIDAR for different purposes. Regarding sound generation, these limits create a lot of artefacts, which in some cases are the reason for the "good" sound. Depends on the way you access the table and (pre)process a wave.
And yes, I know the microwave - I even tried to emulate it using also wave table synthesis:
At the moment, I am evaluating a new way of WTS, which is first possible with the current technology and available at a reasonable price. It requires some processing power and tricky resource management, but in some weeks I shall be able to present some results. Currently I am waiting for the new PCB. Since I plan a release also for B2C, it might be possible that there will be someting available in summer. Maybe as a companion to the Virus.
+1 for Wavetable synthesis. I use Serum alot in my projects and I would like my Virus to be utilized more!
Just for those who come over this thread:
The wavetable synthesis I talked about (also the virtual one with dynamically calculated waves from equations) are present and might be available in DIY-platforms soon. There is some negotiation to be done since there is an active 5Y-NDA regarding some designs I sold.
To get informed about the wave table functions I integrated in my synth see these pages:
http://www.96khz.org/htm/wavetablemodule.htm (actually one table for all voices, but with 8 waves only, in PGP-style)
http://www.96khz.org/htm/wavetablesynthesis.htm (one parameter-set (= equation) for each part, offering an unlimited number of waveforms, there is only a bandwidth limit according to the highest frequency of 768kHz/8)
The idea behind that can be read here:
(capable of producing "almost squares" with up to 15th harmonic.
This core is running in 2 non musical applications too.
Since Access does not offer reloadable wave tables, this might be a good add to the synth.