Static + Clicks in Tutorial FLP Project

    Intriguingly, yes, when listening to the headphones out of the Virus, the sound is perfectly aligned. However, as soon as I take the headphones off and listen to my speakers, I'm back to the delay. It's not a huge delay, but quite noticeable, especially with short notes.


    I've captured the audio that I hear through my speakers, so you can hear this delay, even with S/PDIF, when aligned with a 4/4 kick:
    http://www61.zippyshare.com/v/18032113/file.html


    (Note also in this sample, around the 0:12 mark, a little bit of static. So the static occurs along with the delay when listening to my speakers.)


    With headphones, however, it's perfect, no delay, so I think we're on to something here.


    Yes, I've verified that all the Virus parts are Out1 L+R. Something I wanted to confirm, is it correct that my FL-level soundcard setting is "M-Audio Delta ASIO", as shown below? The reason I ask is, there's also an option there called "S/PDIF M-Audio Delta", but I am not selecting it. Should I? When I try it, there's no sound at all, so I've decided to stick with "M-Audio Delta ASIO". I have not yet done anything with the Clock.


    [Blockierte Grafik: http://i46.tinypic.com/153wwht.jpg]


    Thanks, awaiting your further comments!

    Bob,


    First of all, I don't have "DMA Buffer Size", I only have this under 'Hardware': "ASIO/WDM Buffer Size". Is that the same thing?


    Experience shows that when I tweak this ASIO/WDM Buffer Size, the results are unpredictable, sometimes it's fine as I decrease it all the way to 128, sometimes it immediately starts crashing. I've found that the only reliable setting is to keep it at 512.


    The main issue for me continues to be the Delay/Lag. When I return to the FL Project's original setting of Delay Compensation = 85 ms (which I have since turned off since we were trying SPDIF), the alignment improves, although it's inconsistent and still not perfect. However, do we still need this setting on the master channel? In theory, SPDIF should take care of the delay without FL's Delay Compensation, correct? However, when I turn it off, the delay is there.


    The clicks are occasional. Sometimes they happen in the middle of the track, sometimes not.


    With the Delay issue, the Virus is unusable for me. I've hit this snag and unless I can find a consistent and reliable workaround, it's going to be very frustrating. I'm happy the SPDIF connection is working, but what's the problem with the way FL sends MIDI notes?

    Zitat von eugenebalt

    I don't have "DMA Buffer Size", I only have this under 'Hardware': "ASIO/WDM Buffer Size". Is that the same thing?

    Is it where you can set the buffer in both milliseconds and samples? then yes.
    I think we should try one last thing just to test who's to blame. Do you have a cable that is a headphones plug on one side and stereo RCA pair on the other? It's a very common one. Plug it to the headphones out of the Virus and to the analog audio in of the soundcard. Instead of the S/PDIF track create an analog audio in L+R monitoring track, but set it up the same way. Play your project and mind the headphones output level. If the lag still exists then the problem is not with the Virus, but either FL studio or your soundcard. A possible way to overcome this may be to use an external mixer, there are many small and relatively cheap ones that look like this:
    [Blockierte Grafik: http://static.musiciansfriend.com/derivates/6/001/329/901/DV019_Jpg_Regular_631262_R.jpg]

    Zitat von eugenebalt

    The clicks are occasional. Sometimes they happen in the middle of the track, sometimes not.

    Remember the picture of the audio settings of FL you posted earlier? It says "Underruns: 152" in there. Each underrun results in a click. Your system is not fully streamlined.

    Would I still be able to use the VC Plugin in that case, with all its features?


    How would that solve the MIDI Delay problem? FL is having trouble sending MIDI notes, in this case it would just be sending notes thru the mixer?


    What are some brands/examples of mixers I should look at? What is that in your picture?

    We have already established that it is not a MIDI delay problem by listening to the Virus using headphones and finding out that it is in sync with the soundcard output. Now all that is left is to see if the added delay is only in the case of S/PDIF or that it is present when using the RCA analog inputs as well. That's why I think you should do the test with the "headphones to RCA pair" cable too. If you find out that the delay is always present, you can ask for support from M-Audio, try looking for a different soundcard, try using a different DAW then FL (one that compensates for the delay from VC - given that you have overcome the USB bandwidth problem), or do the mixing outside of your computer.
    One option for mixing outside of your computer is to use the Virus as the mixer: Change the settings to that the S/PDIF is the main out of your soundcard, connect the breakout cable's S/PDIF out to the Virus S/PDIF in, and you don't need a monitoring track in this case because the Virus is doing the mixing, not the DAW. You can control the level in which the S/PDIF input is mixed in the Virus on the LCD screen, from the config menu - select S/PDIF input, then while the track is running adjust the input through, and if needed the sensitivity parameters. Then, connect the Virus to whatever you use for listening.
    The other option of mixing outside of the DAW is using a small mixer that can accept your soundcard's RCA output, and the Virus' analog outs and mix between them. In the picture I posted, you see a Behringer Xenyx 502, although I don't know if its RCA inputs can mix or they are only for bypass. You should go to a music/professional sound store (even compare between more then one store) and describe your problem, and hopefully they will help you choose the right one.
    I know this post might leave you more confused than before, but take it one sentence at a time - I think you have already come very far in diagnosing your problem.

    Thanks for the help so far, Bob.


    I also need to ask this: suppose I go back to the Tutorial FLP project which uses Delay Compensation on the Master, which seems to be the easiest thing to do. I may revert to that. As I wrote, that example setup was working; the Tutorial had a 98ms Pre-Delay on the Master channel. No S/PDIF, just the regular FL Delay Compensation I had originally.


    Suppose I add 2 samples of my own (not related to the Virus): both are kicks; one is not routed to any FX-channel (blank), and another one has some kind of FX on it (routed to a valid FX channel).


    What I hear is that the non-routed kick sample is aligned well with the melody, but the FX-Kick is not, there's a lag. Moreover, when the two kicks play together, they're not aligned with each other. Somehow, having an FX on a track messes up the Master channel's PRE in the Tutorial project. Do you know how I can make all my FX-samples aligned with the Virus in this Tutorial project? It seems that my own samples/tracks are only aligned with the Virus when they're not routed to any FX-channel. This is a problem because I may need to add FX to all kinds of tracks. Thanks!

    But the latency compensation is already set to 98ms on the Master Channel in the tutorial project. I don't need to re-calculate it - it's working. It's just that my custom samples routed to an FX channel (ultimately sending to Master, but the FX channel itself isn't Master) are misaligned, they have to be blank (non-routed) to be aligned with the TI. That's what I'm wondering about.

    Update: It all works now! I had to set the FX-Channel's POST to the same as the Master Channel's PRE (98.68ms). Now everything's aligned. Thanks, I think we can consider this thread closed! The Tutorial's DelayComp settings work fine and get rid of the latency, provided I leave a few empty bars for the Virus to "prepare." I can live with this workaround. Thanks again, Bob!