Beiträge von SOS

Hey Marc, thanks for the reply!

One of the first things I did was test the analog outs (through VC). Same issue. In fact, you had recommended doing so in a thread I created a month or so ago about the same problem. My issue is bad enough that I can't even use most of the patches that you created.

timtico,

Thanks for taking the time to reply! I actually made the same transition you did; upgrade to Windows 7, Live 7 to 8. I also have tried 2 dedicated usb cards to no avail as well as yanking out all of my other usb devices.

Now, when you say that you disabled your pci soundcard, does that mean that you are using the Virus as your primary soundcard now?

Thanks again!

Ace17,

Thanks for the offer ! I will try and PM you a little later tonight or tomorrow. I'm pretty sure you can't load many file types on the forum itself.

This test should be interesting because Ruari (who also chimed in on this thread) tested the patch I'm going to send you and reported no crackling. Jorg, however, reproduced the crackling on a setup similar to Ruari's (if my memory serves me correctly). If you report no crackling, I'll be a lot more willing to accept that this issue stems from variances in users' setups.

Ace17,

I think you make some valid points and suggestions. However, Jorg at Access has already confirmed that crackling appears in VC when there is none in standalone. He tested a patch I gave him on a TI2 and a Mac running Cubase. I run a TI1 on a PC running Live. He still got crackling on the patch I gave him and confirmed there was none when using midi/audio outs. Jorg attributes the crackling to a dsp overload. While this may be the case, I am getting crackling on simple patches in a way that never used to happen before. Here is Jorg's response in full:

Zitat

I was able to take a look at this file in depth today. I actually did this here on my Mac setup with a TI2 first and I definitely also get these crackles. It is actually way easier to determine once you take of the distortion effect of FX1. Since Ableton Live seems not have a "list view" for Midi events (or I might not know the program well enough), I exported the clip as a Midi file and imported this into Cubase - which has a list editor. The reason why I did this is fairly simple: I already had cases, where (for whatever reason) doubled notes got recorded into a Midi sequence, which would automatically double the amount of voices needed, since also the notes are doubled. This was not the case with this Ableton Live clip. However as mentioned above I get these crackles here as well. I even clearly can hear notes being cut off, which is a clear indicator that in this particular case there's just too much going on.
The 2nd test I did: I unloaded the Virus TI Control plugin (in Cubase in this case) and routed the Midi file with the pattern to the TI Synth port, so basically like running the TI as a normal hardware synth, but without the USB interface after copying the sound into one of the RAM Banks of this TI2 here. I can also clearly hear notes cutting off, but so far I did not hear the crackling. This sound is still putting extreme load on the DSP due to the features used and the UNISON being on 4, so the amount of voices created is immense and just too much - hence the cutting off of notes being played. I will try to find out what might be the cause for this crackling when using the TI Control Plugin, but again: even when using the TI2 like a normal hardware synth I clearly hear the unit cutting off voices, since the load is just too much.

And then:

Zitat

I forwarded both your Ableton Live session as well as your report in general to our R&D department. I'm sorry to say but things like that simply will take time to investigate and to address. I ask for your understanding.
First our engineers need to find out what is causing this exactly and then they can try to address this.

I cannot offer you a solution for this at this point other than you trying to keep the amount of voices low if possible.

Again, the problem I'm having is that these crackles persist despite patch complexity/polyphony. I did send Jorg a complex patch, but mostly because I believed that the results would be reproducible. If the problem in fact has something to do with the Virus running out of resources, the fact remains that it only causes audio glitches in Virus Control and not standalone.

I guess the question that I have is: Is anyone actually using Virus Control without problems?

muzikman,

While I appreciate your appeal for civility, I am the op of this thread and not once have I ever disrespected anyone from Access.

User error? Please. I have been a user since January 2006, back when OS 1 was going to be the big fix for everyone. Over the years I have been fortunate enough to not have many of the problems that users have experienced, or at least found workarounds. However, recently (over the last year or so), I have been experiencing audio crackling to a degree that makes Virus Control unusable. I'm talking single patches and low polyphony. Jorg from Access Music has already confirmed that crackling occurs when using VC that does not occur in stand alone. In regard to this his response was (copied directly from my email):

Zitat

I cannot offer you a solution for this at this point

Please do not derail this thread (which is on the 4th page and has had over 800 views) because ONE user vented their frustration in a somewhat rude way.

Zitat

voice stealing. I get this shit from a single patch, single note, 1 bar showing on the intensity meter. No voice stealing going on here.

Yeah, I have had a similar experience. I tried to communicate this to Access, but the only advice they could give me was to watch my voice count.

VC is unusable for me.

Yeah, same thing here. While I was grateful for the suggestion, I didn't expect much as Jorg had already confirmed crackling issues related to voice stealing.

Thanks for the reply Marc.

Do you mean that playback latency (a midi sequence) will increase or is it the latency experienced while playing the keyboard (or both)? I have always felt that the latency while playing the Virus (via midi keyboard) felt excessive but figured it was due to usb issues. Perhaps it's been my soundcard all along?

pentaeolian,

Thanks for the suggestion. I am definitely set to "high performance" right now but I'll give "balanced" a shot and report back.

Hey Suges,

Thanks for the offer to help but alas, I am using Windows 7.

Interesting point about an error in the usb path interfering with Virus Control's ability to correctly utilize the direct outs. Still, Jorg was able to produce crackling (with a very resource heavy patch that I gave him) through usb and the direct outs with a TI2 running on a Mac. He also confirmed that the crackling was not present in stand alone, suggesting that VC is definitely doing something to the audio even when using the direct outs. Jorg suggested that the audio glitches I'm hearing are resulting from voice stealing, but I'm having issues with single factory presets that never gave me problems before.

Anyways, I agree that a ton of users would be happy with a version of Virus Control that leaves the audio untouched.

Zitat

VC: check and warning for buffer size related issues

I received an error message about my buffer sizes because I use the Emu 1616m which (for some reason) only allows for really strange buffer settings.

What are the implications of using incompatible buffer settings (which I have been all along)?

I'm pretty sure my crackling issue isn't derived from this issue as Jorg was able to reproduce crackling on a resource intensive patch with a TI2. Nonetheless, I seem to be getting much more crackling than ever before and the audio buffer seems to be a likely suspect (although I have also tested the TI as a soundcard to no avail).

Thanks for the input Suges.

So are you suggesting that latency is your only issue with Virus Control? It was like that for me for several years but over the last year I have gotten crackling and audio glitches to a degree that makes it nearly impossible to get a single part into audio. The direct outs do not solve this problem for me, but using the Virus through midi does. Jorg at Access Music has confirmed this behavior.

I'm assuming you've already tested the direct (hardware) outs through Virus Control.

Anyways, there is a similar feature request thread going entitled "patch editor version of virus control," perhaps you could chime in and +1.

What I can't fathom is why/how the direct outs in Virus Control still cause glitches. When I first started posting about this months ago Marc seemed to suggest that using the analog outs from Virus Control would somehow bypass the program's handling of audio. This is clearly not the case as the glitches remain.

Seriously Access, do something about this.

Actually, patch browsing from the hardware isn't too bad. You can use the search feature to browse through sound categories and the soft knobs in conjunction with shift can scroll through patches and banks. I agree, however, nothing beats having it all in front of you like in Virus Control.

Zitat

Is VC turned off and an oldskool midi cable literally the only way to go here???

At this point, yes. If you check my first post you can see that Jorg said there is no solution at this time. In fact, I haven't been monitoring this thread because I'm trying to figure out if it's worth it for me to keep the Virus without Virus Control or to sell it and just get Zebra. Mind you, this is after 5 years of owning the Virus and while I'm comfortable with the Virus hardware I actually program much faster with VC.

Oh and by the way, you don't literally need to use a midi cable, you can use a usb cable with the Virus's "synth" port.

Thanks for the response and ideas MusicMaven!

I'm pretty much with you on your attitude about Virus Control. I'm just concerned that they're working on the next version of the Virus with proper usb implementation, so they're like "sorry..."

I just want to bump this request again. I would be particularly interested in being able to automate clocked LFO rates in standalone.

bratan,

Nice! I didn't even think of arrange view...

Ace17,

So I just had a poke around in the Virus C manual (which actually lists CC assignments) and it seems that you are right, the Virus has a parameter count that far exceeds 128. When I took a second look at reKon's Virus editor, I also noticed that Live isn't a supported host, likely due to its lack of sysex and limit of 128 CCs. I probably overlooked this fact with my Pulse because the Pulse only has 128 parameters.

Oh well.

But let me ask you a question then... Are you running Virus Control smoothly; i.e. no clicks, pos, zipper noises, sync issues etc.?