Sine wave clicks

  • Find "Punch" in the Osc Common menu and see if that needs to be lowered. The manual mentions a higher punch setting will give you a snap in the attack if desired.

    Seems like I read somewhere a long time ago that attack clicks are a normal artifact when building synths, and manufacturers usually pre-attenuate this for the user's convenience. However, Access decided to leave it to the user to decide if they want to attenuate it or not (if I am remembering all of that correctly).

    Hope that helps,

    Cheers!





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  • Additionally to Punch, you can also try to lock the Osc start. Don’t remember which menu right now.

    Bass Player and Synthesist.
    Virus TI2 Darkstar | Virus TI2 Desktop | Sub 37 | Voyager RME | Machinedrum | Analog Four | Digitone | MPC Live | NI Maschine+
    Mac OS 13.6.6 (Ventura) | Cubase Pro 13.0 | Ableton Live 9.6 | Logic 10.8 | MainStage 3.6 | NI Komplete Ultimate 14 | RME Fireface UFX+

  • Is it Phase Init? ((x2) EDIT of OSC2 = Common1/2)

    Exactly, it’s called Phase Init. Depending on the phase, a wave may start at a zero crossing or at any other point in the wave. As you might know from sample editing, anything besides a zero crossing will cause clicks.

    Bass Player and Synthesist.
    Virus TI2 Darkstar | Virus TI2 Desktop | Sub 37 | Voyager RME | Machinedrum | Analog Four | Digitone | MPC Live | NI Maschine+
    Mac OS 13.6.6 (Ventura) | Cubase Pro 13.0 | Ableton Live 9.6 | Logic 10.8 | MainStage 3.6 | NI Komplete Ultimate 14 | RME Fireface UFX+

    Edited once, last by ozon ().

  • I've tried adjusting phase init on both OSC 1 and OSC 2 with Sync both on and off and it doesn't stop sine waves from clicking no matter what level I set the phase init to.


    What am I missing?

    So, you adjusted Punch, and tried to adjust Phase Init and your sine wave still clicks? Did you try with just one oscillator? Did you try to adjust the amp envelope attack to a very small value?

    Do you see the click in the waveform if you record the sound?

    Bass Player and Synthesist.
    Virus TI2 Darkstar | Virus TI2 Desktop | Sub 37 | Voyager RME | Machinedrum | Analog Four | Digitone | MPC Live | NI Maschine+
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  • 1 oscillator, punch 0, phase init 127, amp env 19 - 25 the click starts to diminish if I turn the high eq all the way down. And for some reason the wavetable sine seems to have less click noise than the classic sine.


    It's got a lo-fi vibe since all the top end frequencies have been cut over 10kHz but the click is mostly gone.


    I was hoping it would retain some of that high end with the wave starting at the zero crossing.


    This was mostly just an experiment since I love using sine waves in combination with other oscillators but the click gets annoying to deal with.

  • This seems odd. I have to try this myself.

    BTW, a sine wave doesn’t have any „top end“ as there‘s no harmonics at all. Are you sure the Noise OSC is completely off?


    As already asked: Do you see the click in the waveform if the recorded sound?

    Bass Player and Synthesist.
    Virus TI2 Darkstar | Virus TI2 Desktop | Sub 37 | Voyager RME | Machinedrum | Analog Four | Digitone | MPC Live | NI Maschine+
    Mac OS 13.6.6 (Ventura) | Cubase Pro 13.0 | Ableton Live 9.6 | Logic 10.8 | MainStage 3.6 | NI Komplete Ultimate 14 | RME Fireface UFX+

  • This seems odd. I have to try this myself.

    BTW, a sine wave doesn’t have any „top end“ as there‘s no harmonics at all. Are you sure the Noise OSC is completely off?


    As already asked: Do you see the click in the waveform if the recorded sound?

    You're right about the harmonics, I realized that after I wrote that and was playing around with it more. I think the click gives the illusion of there being higher frequencies, but when its gone you just hear the pure signal.


    And no actually, zooming into the wav it looks like it does start at zero and then begins to oscillate.


    I'll attach the patch. If anyone can make a better pure sine wave patch feel free to share it.

  • Indeed, looking zoom in recording "Wave" the start "slams"
    Tried lots of solutions...
    I have one, which "once in 5 clicks" (the next 4 others do not) and the click is very low
    With an Attack of "19" and Decay of "0"
    - Full LFO(1) square/ Trigger Phase 127/
    - In the matrix: LFO(1) assigned to "0" on attack because boosted with the "10%constant" of "22"

  • Edit: i found a better solution: TI2 Sine Without pop


    This phenomenon occurs in most synths and samplers. You can try other synthesizers (hardware or software - it doesn't matter). Even if you record it, for example, in Ableton, and loop only a small section (or only one cyle) in Simpler or Sampler, the "amp env pop" is still there. You can smooth it out with amp attack and release, but it's still present. This is related to the amp envelope of the synthesizer and/or sampler.


    My workaround:

    Resample or record the sine/wave sound from your synthesizer and loop the recorded audio clip somewhere in the middle at zero crossing points (do not crop the clip because you will get some "pop" again) - loop the clip - now you can play/trigger the clip without the "pop".

    But as said, if you load that clip in Sampler or Simpler, you get the "pop" sound again.

  • Indeed, looking zoom in recording "Wave" the start "slams"
    Tried lots of solutions...
    I have one, which "once in 5 clicks" (the next 4 others do not) and the click is very low
    With an Attack of "19" and Decay of "0"
    - Full LFO(1) square/ Trigger Phase 127/
    - In the matrix: LFO(1) assigned to "0" on attack because boosted with the "10%constant" of "22"

    Nice, yours sounds better with the longer attack.

  • - Full LFO(1) square/ Trigger Phase 127/
    - In the matrix: LFO(1) assigned to "0" on attack because boosted with the "10%constant" of "22"

    What do you want to achieve with that?

    I guess what you wanted to do is to turn LFO 1 into a constant value. But instead you're turning it into an extremely fast Square wave LFO. Which is used to modulate the length of the amp envelope attack phase. That doesn't make much sense to me.


    In order to have LFO 1/2 to be used as constant, you can:

    - Set Shape to Pulse

    - Set Rate to 0

    - Set Contour to +63

    - Set Envelope Mode to enabled


    or

    - Set Shape to Pulse

    - Set Rate to 0

    - Set Contour to +63

    - Set Trigger Phase to 1 (or 127)


    Theoretically, the second method would give a very short click on each LFO cycle, but it's actually not audible.



    PS: There's also no need to redirect the 10% constant to a different slot. You could directly route it to adjust the Amp Envelope Attack.

    Bass Player and Synthesist.
    Virus TI2 Darkstar | Virus TI2 Desktop | Sub 37 | Voyager RME | Machinedrum | Analog Four | Digitone | MPC Live | NI Maschine+
    Mac OS 13.6.6 (Ventura) | Cubase Pro 13.0 | Ableton Live 9.6 | Logic 10.8 | MainStage 3.6 | NI Komplete Ultimate 14 | RME Fireface UFX+

    Edited once, last by ozon ().

  • Regarding the Since click. IMO, it's in fact a psychoacoustic phenomenon because the sound starts suddenly if the amp envelope has a very short attack time, and can be compensated for with adjusting the attack.


    Important factors to get a pure sine without click:

    - Disable all distortion stages of the Virus, including the Character settings which are often forgotten. Set Analog Boost Intensity to 0.

    - Set Punch to 0

    - Set Phase Init to 1or 127 ( OSC 1 and OSC 2 in Phase) or 63 (OSC1 and OSC2 out of phase). If you're just using OSC 1, Phase Init can be any value larger than 0, as Phase Init will start OSC1 always at 0 of the wave. See Virus TI reference manual on Phase Init.


    To compensate for the perceived click, the Amp Envelope Attack can be adjusted using the Attack knob. Additionally it can be refined, by using a Matrix slot with the 10% constant to fine adjust Amp Env Attack.


    You can also use recursive envelope modulation to change the curve of the Attack phase by using a Matrix slot where the Amp Envelope is the source to modulate the Amp Env Attack. To me, this gives the best result for a fast smooth attack without perceived click.

    Files

    Bass Player and Synthesist.
    Virus TI2 Darkstar | Virus TI2 Desktop | Sub 37 | Voyager RME | Machinedrum | Analog Four | Digitone | MPC Live | NI Maschine+
    Mac OS 13.6.6 (Ventura) | Cubase Pro 13.0 | Ableton Live 9.6 | Logic 10.8 | MainStage 3.6 | NI Komplete Ultimate 14 | RME Fireface UFX+

    Edited once, last by ozon ().

  • Good morning,

    My idea was to have the lfo "cut" the click (of the sharp attack) by a high speed to reduce the chances.
    This gives (see Attachment):

    But, thank you for your very accurate analysis :)

  • Important factors to get a pure sine without click:

    - Disable all distortion stages of the Virus, including the Character settings which are often forgotten.

    Right, for this purpose, I uploaded a clean, empty patch for a while: Virus TI - Empty Bank


    i think i found a good solution:


    1) load my --init-- preset (in the attachment)

    2) change osc to sine

    2) set the "Key Mode" to Mono 1 (Common Parameters)


    done :)


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